Rome or home? Discernment chart for vicars

Here's a flow-chart for Church of England priests considering whether to accept the Pope's offer of a post-Anglican sanctuary within the Catholic Church, courtesy of the Beaker Folk of Husborne Crawley (cyber-coenobites, apparently) -- h/t Andrew Brown at the Guardian.

C of E Discernment chart

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Brian Thompson
8 years 6 months ago
While funny at times, that is a little mean spirited.
Its also very "you" centered, rather than focised on drawing closer to Truth regardless of the cost.
That said. I know it is not meant to be taken 100% seriously.
8 years 6 months ago

This might be America's example of the politicians' social security issue: the proverbial third rail. It will be interesting to see if there are any substantive comments. I do not know the author, so I hesitate to agree that it is 'mean spirited.' I did, however, chuckle when I followed the flow chart. 

Austen Ivereigh
8 years 6 months ago

I'm glad you chuckled, Mary. It was intended to be humorous. But needing to point that out makes it less so. Oh dear.

Archdruid Eileen
8 years 6 months ago
Yes it was intended to be humorous, and thanks for thinking it was.  It certainly wasn't meant to be mean-spirited.  But in hindsight I can see it could be taken so, and thanks to Brian for pointing this out.  Sometimes you write something, think it's funny, and forget to consider the effect you can inadvertently have.  So I've removed it and replaced it with a request for charity and prayer.  In fact I believe you're the only place still hosting it (though I'm sure it's in the Google Cache somewhere).
God bless you all
8 years 6 months ago
This is funny. But it's funny because it is true, so I think we're being a bit disengenuous here.
Even the most biting parts, are indeed true. Unfortunate, yes. I wish we weren't even joking about these thing. But true, nonetheless.
An episcopal priest with a wife and kids will earn very little as a Catholic priest, so his wife probably had best earn a very good salary.
And a gay episcopal priest would not be welcomed into the Catholic church lest he were able to cover up his orientation so as not to cause scandal. Celibacy goes without saying.
Brian Thompson
8 years 6 months ago

Sorry to make a big deal. I didnt mean it was scathing and offensive, just a little caustic perhaps sarchastic. Not ideal, but whatever, I myself can have a somewhat wry sense of humor at times.
As for married priests with kids, though I am aware that in the early years the converting anglicans will be strapped for cash, how does the Episcopal community deal with the salary of their married ministers at present? is there any way we might set up such an arrangement for them in the fullness of time? Would a provided rectory be enough of a benefit so that the pay wouldnt need to be much higher than normal? Ironically I am a young seminarian and so have no clue how the mortgage on a home works since I am not likely to be in a position to need to own a home. That is one we could definatly figure out though, albeit in the long run.
As for those Anglican ministers who suffer from same-sex attraction, I would hope there is something that could be done. I know that those who have deep seated urges in that direction are inelligible for Orders due to the Pope's 2005 diciplinary policy. I don't know; it just seems that some arrangement might be made on a case-by-case basis if the man in question is perhaps not afflicted to the point where it would interfere with the duties and life required of a preist.
As for women... Priesthood is not an open discussion. It just isn't. I am cool with that, some people arent. The Church is not changing either way.
Though, in the end, as I said, practical considerations, though important, are not as important as following Truth wherever it leads you. If it means you have to work in the private sector or in the Church as a lay minister or a Deacon rather than as a Priest, that might be the cost of following the Truth. Though, were I Pope (god help us all), I would be very careful to ensure that proper discernment and consideration would be given to incoming Anglican ministers, lest the legal structure the Church has erected for them inadvertently squash or damage their vocations.        

Pearce Shea
8 years 6 months ago
It's a shame, but my first reaction was the same as Brian's. For a Catholic living in a deeply anti-Church area, it's a shame that my first reaction has become kneejerk defensiveness.
Archdruid Eileen
8 years 6 months ago
Brian - thanks, if I'd put your comments on my flowchart it would have made perfect sense and looked less aggressive.  But then the website wouldn't be the work of humorous "fiction" I hope it is.
I have friends who are working their way through this flowchart, so to speak, at the moment.  For some of them making the decision is fairly straightforward.  They have always inclined towards Rome, they feel that the Church of England has changed (as indeed it has) and they've retired or they're heading towards retirement.  The change will still be painful for them but at least the hurdles are low.  
Others with a wife and family - it's a much more difficult decision.  They've responsibilities towards their children as well as to their consciences about the church.  They may have to give up their full-time ministry to work in secular roles, when what they were called to was pastoral work and evangelism.  The Pope's "generous" offer is generous on a church organisation way, but he's not suddenly going to find extra money for this one as far as I can see.
Austen Ivereigh
8 years 6 months ago
Lest readers are unclear, Archdruid Eileen is one of the Beaker Folk of Husborne Crawley - ''where creation is respected; where the divine is encountered; where trees are sung to. Where no bunny goes un-hugged.'' It's ironic in a very British way - not a spoof, but tongue-in-cheek. The fact that we're able to laugh at her flow-chart is because, as anonymous says, there's a lot of truth in it, although obviously nobody's discernment can be reduced to a flow chart. But there's nothing mean-spirited about it; it's done in love and good humor. So congratulations to the Archdruid, and apologies if some of the comments here have led her to take it down from her wonderful website; and while I understand her self-consciousness, I see no reason not to leave it up here.


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